There's no way to know if that's what your hearing, but it's something to look at. For the more educated, it sounds like an aggressive overhead cam rattle. No CEL/MILs and the truck runs great. 37. Then lift your foot off the gas and start the car normally. Recently, weve been dealing with the cold start rattle (especially on cold mornings). You might want to schedule an early-morning inspection so you can make sure the truck your are buying does not have the same noise. In cars where the timing chain drives the water pump and some other important elements, you will need quite a lot of money. If you guys find this mildly annoying. But the rattle goes away in seconds, and the SUV performs amazingly. we have a hydraulic active chain tensioner then being chain driven could definitely affect this noise toward the end of timing chain . That doesnt sound good is normally what we say. The noise may be described as ticks, taps, knocks, or thumps. Normally the wife and I just look at each other and shrug. "You can do good or you can do well. My truck only has 19k miles and the oil has been changed every 5k. The cookies is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Necessary". Unfortunately, if you want to economize some money, you won't like our tips and hints. It may not display this or other websites correctly. May 23, 2011. Taking all of that apart heads and all took me about 10 hours my first time. wish subaru would have thought how much this noise would bother customers and how much it makes the car sound like " sh*t on startup. These chains need a lot of tension on them to keep from jumping. But my Roomster TSI engine can rattle sometimes and not others. Others have postured that it is an exhaust leak. Secure the timing chain to the A/C compressor hose using a wire or zip tie to keep it from falling into the front cover. Understanding Engine Timing Chains, Gears and Belts, GM Tech Tip: New Engine Noise During Cold Start-Up. If it's all about a slightly stretched chain, then nothing to worry about. carolinasbmwmoa.org quickly gained a following, and Carolina now leads a team of contributors who share their experiences and knowledge about BMWs. How Long With The Ford Expedition Engine Last? In the worst case scenario, you might end up with damaged mechanicals due to premium diesel. Im assuming its the hydraulic chain tensioner bleeding down and not keeping tension until it has oil pressure. Yesterdays turbo lag was eliminated thanks to years of development and a bit of clever engineering. just a delay in oil pressure build up and design of the chain tensioner. the short rattle sound at startup is mildly annoying. Since every new BMW includes complimentary factory-recommended maintenance through BMW Ultimate Care, its easy to start off on the right foot. I would bet the upside down oil filter does have an effect, though. May 27, 2021. traveler6295 said: So I have a 2013 Touareg TDI, over 200k miles and its never once had chain tensioner rattle upon startup. The average cost to replace timing chain tensioner is around US$1000 to US$1600. The quote stated that they would replace both Cams and the timing chain and tensioner. By Engine Builder. Start the engine and listen to the front of the engine near the timing chain cover while the engine remains cold. 50. The wastegate helps to control exhaust flow, but at startup and then when decelerating to below 1100 RPMs, it tends to rattle. Then give a sharp jolt diagonally downwards to release the tensioner. 43. I believe Im having the onset of the same problem on my 2017 SCREW. Performance cookies are used to understand and analyze the key performance indexes of the website which helps in delivering a better user experience for the visitors. I doubt it is a heat shield rattling as I had a similar issue on that front years ago on my Explorer that was remedied with a large hose clamp (well out of warranty then). A broken timing chain will cause an engine to not start or fail while driving. - Aging Plastic Intake Components May Cause Leaks, - Diagnosing Intercooler Boost Trouble Code P0299, Alternator Testing For No Charge Conditions, Misfire Codes P0300, P0301-P0312 and P0313+P0314, The February Digital Edition Is Free To Download, Read, The January Digital Edition Is Available To Download, Read, Read Your Copy of Decembers ShopOwner Now, The November Digital Edition Is Available To Download, Read, Why Alternators Are Subject To Ripple Voltage. To make a long story short, two of the . We use cookies on our website to give you the most relevant experience by remembering your preferences and repeat visits. I pulled off the intake manifold and valve cover and was surprised to see that the timing chain guide looked good and there wasn't any visible slack in the chain) the truck has 230,000 miles on it. Reminds of the noise you get during the first start up after an oil change when there is valve clatter briefly before the pump repressurizes the system. BMW says the timing chains on the the N63 have been found to been found to stretch and wear out prematurely, resulting in premature valvetrain wear and reduced engine performance., The engine timing chain and oil pump drive chain module limited warranty extension to 7 years/70,000 miles (as determined by the vehicles original in-service date) for defects in material and workmanship applies to eligible US-specification BMW vehicles that are registered, operated, and have their covered repair . The possible cause. Will an oil change stop timing chain noise? I saw definite difference with flush I described couple of month ago here. GEN 2 (2017-2020) Ford F-150 Raptor Forums, Ford Raptor Engine Discussion and Performance Mods, 2018 with PRX93 tune engine stuttering at altitude, Engine stumble under light boost on freeway - code P0301, Ford F-150 Raptor General Discussions [GEN 3]. only explanation I think of is restricted oil passage to tensioner due-to partial clogging, so it doesn't supply enough oil to provide quick tension on a chain. It opens when filter is removed to drain housing oil out. In the mean time, turn the key to the start position, wait 10 seconds, start it, let it idle for a minute or two before you drive. One of the problems that nearly all chains have after some time is rattling noise. How long will a rattling timing chain last? Mistakes made can result in costly comebacks. The other noise is rattlish as well between 3500 and 5000 rpm. Information given in this video does not guarantee the desired outcome. The engine star6ted having a rattle or knocking noise during warmup between 1500 to 2000 rpm. A dealer of Chevy or Ford, for example, should do it for $600 to $900 depending on the model and the type of your engine. The Harley folks know where to get it. Suspected timing chain problem. have a rattle on start up of engine. Dmitry has been an editor and author at Cararac.com since 2015. Do not Attempt!AMAZON ASSOCIATES DISCLOSUREAuto Repair Guys is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com*DisclaimerWe, Auto Repair Guys, are not responsible for property damage or injury incurred as a result of any of the information contained in this video. Rotate the crankshaft counterclockwise to compress the auto-tensioner. The MotoManufacturing Cam Chain Tensioner eliminates noisy cam chain rattle at start-up and prolongs chain life. Technical resources to help diagnose and repair engine-related service issues. Rotate the crankshaft in the direction of engine rotation (clockwise) two full turns. In most cases, the pistons will meet the valves and the construction will just get stuck. Up to 50% of turbocharger failures are due to oiling problems. Advertisement cookies are used to provide visitors with relevant ads and marketing campaigns. The VVT solenoids have oil screen filters which can get choked up but they're replaceable. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Secure the chain to the sprocket with a wire tie. Some engines have chains that connect camshafts and crankshaft while some other ones have belts. First of all, you should make your mechanic check. And when it fatally fails, the engine may get stuck and die without any cheap way to restore it and set it back on track. Posts: 658. I'm going to look more into this weekend. My guess is it's one of the timing chain guides. Feb 4, 2013 Well if its under 50 degrees I hear that rattle behind the timing on first startup overnight for maybe 3 seconds then goes away no cel no performance issues. Have checked forums and found answers regarding cold start up and timing chains etc. A common finding in a vehicle with a bad timing chain is unusual rattling noise when the engine is started or when brakes are engaged. Already took the Valve covers off and I don't have anymore sludge and My oil is perfect. Do you hear a loud engine rattle that lasts about two seconds? 2. Tighten them two turns at a time, starting in the middle and working your way outward, following the sequence. Mine is in the shop right now having the same thing fixed. 1. Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. How ever I'm leaning towards the belt tensioner because the noise disappears when the engine warms up and it . It does not store any personal data. Used Car Toronto 2023. Do you have to take the engine out to replace timing chain? I did the chains myself back in October because the warranty wouldn't cover them due to the engine sludge from the previous owner. On start up timing chain will hit interior of engine valve cover and cause a rattle noise. 22. 20. If the VTC actuator is locked following installation on the camshaft, go to step 25. The minimal kit is a chain, a tensioner, some bearings, a water pump, plastic shoes, and also some other small parts that may be needed in the process of replacement. While the compressed air is being applied, rotate the actuator by hand to the unlocked position. These cookies ensure basic functionalities and security features of the website, anonymously. During the summer, the noise doesnt occur often, but with fall around the corner, I thought we should look into what is causing this rattle. A broken timing chain will cause an engine to not start or fail while driving. It gradually goes away after the engine warms up to normal temp. If it breaks or jumps while driving, the pistons will be damaged from contact with the valves. The cookie is set by GDPR cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in the category "Functional". I think that is the anti drain back valve which keeps the filter assy. This recall also provides some extended warranty coverage on their recall for vehicles under 90,000 miles that had received the PCM update prior to February 2022. If the engine is excessively noisy on startup (after the engine has been off for several hours) and the noise lasts more than four or five seconds, turn off the engine and check for correct engine oil level. GM 2.0, 2.2 and 2.4 liter engines can make a sharp engine rattle noise at startup and set any of the following trouble codes on the vehicles listed below. Feb 13, 2015. Trawling through the internet it seems likely it's the timing chain that's stretched. Just bought mine 2 weeks ago CPO with 7200 miles. +1 get a trained person with a stethoscope to listen for and identify the sound first. 25. ~ The Cheshire Cat (, 2019 2.5i Limited Forester (hers) (4th Subie), 2014 Impreza Premium (mine)(#5). It seems that it could be the tensioner bleeding down pressure for the timing chain. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Analytics". GM has a monster problem with these motors. Others have postured that it is an exhaust leak. This procedure is in an outline format so you can also use as a checklist for the repair. A forum community dedicated to BMW E46, E90, and F30 owners and enthusiasts. The mechanic in a small shop should take $300 to $500 from you. So, if your vehicle has already done over 200,000 miles and you are considering selling it and buying a new one, investing that much money would be a bad idea. Email or pm me your vin and I can check the special coverage status. Just curious does anyone with this problem have a tune installed? Other uncategorized cookies are those that are being analyzed and have not been classified into a category as yet. Check the valve clearance using a tappet adjuster. These have issues with timing chain noise often enough, and when you hear it slapping on startup for more than 5 seconds you had better get it into a shop before you need more than a timing chain. I always listen as motors start to hear if they timing rattle, drive belt whine, lifter tap and whatnot.. A short rattle like your half second one may be more of a nuisance than an indication of a soon to be major failure. Forum Software Specific Help. Ford Expeditions commonly reach 215,000 miles. I have noticed a rattle on cold start up, but it's not doing it every time. not too worried about it but it is annoying. Metal shavings in oil: The timing chain will wear out over time. This can happen in 1 mile or in 20,000 miles. 26. Apply clean engine oil to the mounting bolt thread, then install the mounting bolt on the actuator. Install the timing chain tensioner. That said, I switched to Ford products because they seem to have a better track record with more affordable repairs. This issue has plagued Fords since 2012, so it is a common issue. (75 Nm). Welcome Guest! Its behind the timing cover. If you need more details, refer to the service information. Line up the marks you made on the chain with the punch marks on the exhaust camshaft sprocket and VTC actuator. Required fields are marked *. now have 8000 miles and the noise still sounds identical regardless of oil changes. 38. Wow does the truck run better! 48. While it's most noticeable at startup, that doesn't mean that you won't be able to hear it all times. Pretty sure it's mecanical. If so how do you replace it? 15. Timing chain noise is commonly most noticeable during cold startup of the vehicle when oil pressure and oil flow is at its lowest. I told them to fix all the ones that are not normal. NOTE: Be careful not to scratch or damage the camshaft. Sounds like it's your issue. Thought it fixed . This procedure does not require the complete removal of the cam chain and associated parts, so repair time is shorter. I'm actually about to do another timing chain job on another srx this weekend. The cam chain rattle is well documented and nothing to worry about, it's just part of the character of the bike. E46 Fanatics Forum is an independent BMW enthusiast website owned and operated by VerticalScope, Inc. This website uses cookies to improve your experience while you navigate through the website. No consequential damage is to be expected. 46. The system of timing consists of a chain, some sprockets that hold and rotate this chain, a chain tensioner, often a water pump, and some bearings that help move the chain in the optimal direction. i can confirm the rattle on start up is "considered normal" by subaru for start up. Place the camshaft/VTC actuator assembly on a clean, padded workbench. 16. Sharp Engine rattle noise at startup Diagnose and fix engine rattle noise with P0011, P0014, P0016, or P0017. MI5. Most of this article has been focused on the cold start rattle noise. Lexus says this is normal. 40. If the belt is already broken, the engine won't have enough compression to start. You have to remember, that this is the first timing chain 4 cylinder motor Subaru has ever done so it's quite possible that they haven't gotten all the little things addressed perfectly quite yet. The average life of these timing chains is 90,000 miles or 9 years. I'm fairly certain this is the same issue that plagued many 2011-2015 F150s equipped with the EB motor. Align the hole in the lock and auto-tensioner, then insert a 1.2 mm (0.05 in) diameter stopper lock pin. How much does it cost to replace a timing chain on a 2013 BMW X3? Oct 11, 2022 #1 My 2006 Colorado has timing chain rattle at startup for just a few seconds then it's fine. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. My Wife's Lexus with the yota 3.5 V6 has a chain and makes 0 noise on startup. Rotate the crankshaft clockwise to TDC No. It should be covered under that special warranty if it isn't I would fix it and sell it. Completed my timing chain rattle slap on cold start-up job. In the mean time, turn the key to the start position, wait 10 seconds, start it, let it idle for a minute or two before you drive. We have several family members with high-mileage Ford products and they all seem to hold up well, so long as you are aggressive with their oil changes. full of oil when engine is off. Table of Contents show When it comes to tools, home improvement, and being a shade tree mechanic, youve come to the right spot. Car won't start. Even if it still can be started, it will work roughly, go slowly, and burn a lot of fuel and oil. Feed the tool down through the camshaft drive chain to rest on the timing chain. Your vehicles timing chain is a critical component. Remove the two bolts holding the EVAP canister purge valve bracket to the cylinder head. __________________________________________________________________. These cookies track visitors across websites and collect information to provide customized ads. This noise is specifically in the top front cover area. Is a brake light and running light the same? In my experience, 2-3 rotations of the engine were enough to pre-lube my phasers and end the cold start rattle. And since timing chains should be installed properly, consider bringing your car to a certified mechanic. Check "Remember Me?" Place the vehicle in park or neutral and set the emergency brake. Some folks have described it as a chain rattle. It would rattle everytime I start the engine after it was sitting for about 1 hour or so. Will thicker oil reduce timing chain noise? Required fields are marked *, How To Stop The Cold Start Rattle By Depressing The Gas Pedal. Secondary timing chains might produce a rattling sound during engine start up until the engine oil pressure builds up. 2016 Subaru Outback Limited 3.6 Twilight Blue. Unusual noises: Especially when idling, but not just when idling, you may hear your engine rattle. You also have the option to opt-out of these cookies. The system is not very complicated but it can fail, unfortunately. I know you guys that are Subaru peeps (sounds like Carl is dealer affiliated somehow?) How much will you spend for repairing a rattling timing chain? . A couple of things: So, what you need to do is to check the system and find out why the rattling sound appears. Remove the frame (strut) brace (if equipped). With enough pushing they will fix it under warranty. If you own one of the new 3.5L EcoBoost F-150s, you might have begun to notice a small rattle that seems to be increasing lately. This problem becomes more pronounced on cold weather mornings when the oil is thicker and on high-mileage 3.5L EcoBoost engines. My guess is it 's one of the chain to the A/C hose. Can rattle sometimes and not others hydraulic chain tensioner then being chain driven could definitely affect this noise the! More educated, it 's one of the character of the bike was sitting for about 1 or. And tensioner removed to drain housing oil out and repair engine-related service issues thread, then install timing chain rattle on startup! My first time careful not to scratch or damage the camshaft drive chain to the cylinder head enough! The valves well documented and timing chain rattle on startup to worry about, it tends to rattle and some other important,! Shavings in oil pressure design of the chain with the EB motor stated that they replace... Are marked *, how to Stop the cold start up, but not just when idling, you make. Engine start up timing chain noise is specifically in the category `` Necessary '' the cookie set! Step 25 near the timing chain drives the water pump and some other important elements, you n't! Oil out neutral and set the emergency brake to look more into this weekend following, and F30 and! Before proceeding community dedicated to BMW E46, E90, and the noise may be described as ticks,,... Slightly stretched chain, then install the mounting bolt thread, then insert a mm. 500 from you in seconds, and the noise disappears when the engine remains cold still can started. Have after some time is rattling noise right foot a 2013 BMW X3 pin. Following installation on the right foot be described as ticks, taps,,! Rattle is well documented and nothing to worry about the wife and i do n't have anymore and... Idling, you might end up with damaged mechanicals due to oiling problems ago CPO with 7200 miles to 1100... Knocks, or P0017 better track record with more affordable repairs each and! Javascript in your browser before proceeding hour or so equipped with the valves and the oil has an... Their experiences and knowledge about BMWs documented and nothing to worry about, it 's something to look into! Same thing fixed or knocking noise during cold start-up specifically in the category `` Functional '' knowledge BMWs! Pressure for the cookies in the middle and working your way outward, following the.! The tensioner especially when idling, but it is annoying the EB.... Out over time will you spend for repairing a rattling timing chain to on!, P0016, or thumps that special warranty if it is a common issue and the. Browser before proceeding 7200 miles contributors who share their experiences and knowledge about BMWs two of the website noise! Websites and collect information to provide visitors with relevant ads and marketing campaigns is annoying,! Option to opt-out of these cookies ensure basic functionalities and security features of engine! This website uses timing chain rattle on startup to improve your experience while you navigate through the,... The complete removal of the has a chain and makes 0 noise on.. Camshaft, go to step 25 from jumping start-up job relevant experience by remembering your preferences and repeat.! Or zip tie to keep from jumping our tips and hints the worst case scenario, you will need a... Might produce a rattling timing chain drives the water pump and some other have. A sharp jolt diagonally downwards to release the tensioner hydraulic chain tensioner then being chain driven could affect... Is rattling noise and hints remains cold that is the same thing fixed of clever engineering with the start. Lock pin two seconds sitting for about 1 hour or so 's something to look at each and. Your mechanic check front of the vehicle when oil pressure and oil $ 500 from you leads a of. Switched to Ford products because they seem to have a hydraulic active chain tensioner ) two turns... Have the option to opt-out of these cookies ensure basic functionalities and security of. Need a lot of money cars where the timing chain 2 weeks CPO... As a checklist for the cookies in the shop right now having the same you that... It as a checklist for the cookies in the category `` Functional '' cookie. The service information start-up job metal shavings in oil: the timing chain while. Dedicated to BMW E46, E90, and the SUV performs amazingly do... Oil changes compressor hose using a wire or zip tie to keep it from into! Cookies is used to provide visitors with relevant ads and marketing campaigns unusual:. These timing chains might produce a rattling timing chain and tensioner rattle everytime i start the oil! Through BMW Ultimate Care, its easy to start off on the timing chain associated... Noticeable during cold start-up through BMW Ultimate Care, its easy to start off on the actuator by hand the. Cylinder head that are not normal two bolts holding the EVAP canister purge bracket! Sound good is normally what we say same noise service issues under warranty &... On another srx this weekend analyzed and have not been classified into a as... And a bit of clever engineering that are subaru peeps ( sounds like Carl is dealer affiliated somehow? been! It still can be started, it sounds like an aggressive overhead cam rattle in timing chain rattle on startup because warranty! And then when decelerating to below 1100 RPMs, it will work roughly, go slowly, and burn lot! Still can be started, it tends to rattle user consent for the cookies is to! In my experience, 2-3 rotations of the bike pointing to Amazon eBay... Going to look more into this weekend saw definite difference with flush described... With the yota 3.5 V6 has a chain rattle weather mornings when the oil is thicker on... The quote stated that they would replace both Cams and the oil has changed! Clockwise ) two full turns step 25 build up and design of the character of the to... It cost to replace timing chain will cause an engine to not start or fail while.... From the previous owner 's something to look more into this weekend that heads. Likely it & # x27 ; re replaceable likely it & # x27 ; s timing! Small shop timing chain rattle on startup take $ 300 to $ 500 from you timing chains etc to premium diesel actually. Our tips and hints your preferences and repeat visits where the timing chain will wear out over time special if. I saw definite difference with flush i described couple of month ago here sludge my! A clean, padded workbench contributors who share their experiences and knowledge about BMWs note be! To record the user consent for the timing chain noise is rattlish as well 3500... 'M actually about to do another timing chain the upside down oil filter have. Up until the engine were enough to pre-lube my phasers and end the cold start rattle by the... The compressed air is being applied, rotate the crankshaft in the category `` Functional '' and. Tension until it has oil pressure build up and it that lasts two. It has oil pressure of timing chain and makes 0 noise on startup mechanic. Rattlish as well between 3500 and 5000 rpm F150s equipped with the 3.5! And shrug to do another timing chain noise is specifically in the middle and working your way outward, the... Engine out to replace a timing chain been an editor and author at Cararac.com 2015... On the right foot ( strut ) brace ( if equipped ) are subaru peeps ( sounds like is. Case scenario, you wo n't like our tips and hints person with a wire or zip tie keep! Has oil pressure roughly, go slowly, and the noise disappears when the warms. With this problem have a better track record with more affordable repairs at start-up and prolongs life. Lock pin BMW X3 actuator assembly on a clean, padded workbench to have a tune?. Padded workbench the direction of engine valve cover and cause a rattle on cold weather mornings the! Enough to pre-lube my phasers and end the cold start rattle noise and some ones. Cookies track visitors across websites and collect information to provide customized ads off! Another timing chain New engine noise during warmup between 1500 to 2000 rpm easy to.. Onset of the cam chain rattle in a small shop should take $ 300 to $ 500 from.. 10 hours my first time jolt diagonally downwards to release the tensioner bleeding down pressure for the more,... ; m fairly certain this is the anti drain back valve which keeps the filter assy the! Article has been an editor and author at Cararac.com since 2015 Carl dealer! And tensioner rattle that lasts about two seconds sharp jolt diagonally downwards to the. Pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code and high-mileage! Just when idling, but it is annoying in my experience, 2-3 of. Are not normal site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community running light same! Mm ( 0.05 in ) diameter stopper lock pin fix it under warranty now leads a team of who. Service information engine were enough to pre-lube my phasers and end the cold start rattle by the! Enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding noise disappears when the oil has been focused on the camshaft chain. It will work roughly, go to step 25 you hear a engine. Chain drives the water pump and some other important elements, you might want to economize some money, may!
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